[claydos66]

Hello all. I am a 26 year old male with fertility problems as a resultant condition based on medication (prednisone - steroid) from a disease - ulceritic colitis. Let me give you some background info.

My wife and I have been trying well over a year an a half and have lost three babies at different times up to the end of the first trimester. The latest was a month before we started fertility treatments.

She got checked out and was put on clomid and metphormin and provera(sp). So now her body is ok and is ovulating on a calander schedule and so on. Well during the cycles of clomid, I flared up due to stress and everything going on (loss of babies, wife's raging hormones and work). This means that the ulcers came back and I was not too good and have been on prednisone since her first cycle.

Now we are getting sperm results which are horrible. My meds are killing them (as we thought) and I wont be able to get off of them unless my stress level severely decreases.

In the mean time, since my wife has lost three babies, we both want to have one as soon as possible. She doesn't feel whole without one and I can say, neither do I seeing her go through what she has been through. So now we are in a heated debate about IUI (we came to the conclusion early that IVF isn't for us). I have come to the conclusion that I can love anything and anyone no matter what. She is having a harder time because it isn't me and it would be a "stranger inside of her for the next 9 months." I can see how she feels and only understand it. There are so many other issues arrising like, if she doesn't do it, she will never do it and she would want me having a visectomy and so on.

She is very resentful because of my meds and the affect it has on me. She pretty much hates me for that and fights with that everyday.

I don't know what to do or what to say and I'm sure there are women and men out there who have been through the same thing. I just need advice on where to go and what to talk about. Like I've said, I'm open to anything in order to have a kid, but we both can't do IVF. If anyone has experience this, please help us out. thanks.

[hopeful2bmom]

hi there-
altough I am no expert i wanted to give you some info.
First- have you seen a urologist and a reproductive endocrinologist?
in my experience and research, prednisone use should not permanantely affect the sperm quailty. it should reproduce three moths after you stop the medication and if you are not able to stop the medication then IVF with ICSI is a way to correct the sperm issue. This is where thy would retrieve your wife's eggs and collect a sperm sample from you. They would then spin down your sperm and wash it and then select the best quality to fertilixe with.
As for IUI, they also use the spinning down and washing, the only difference is that they would inject then entire sample into your your wife's uterus. In any of these cases she would not be using someone else's sperm.
Also, as dfar as improving your counts and quailty, you should be taking a daily mutil, a zinc supplement and l carnitine as well as trying to avoid american beef as they use anabolic steroids to fatten the cows. organic is the way to go.
having your wofe see that you are taking a step toward improving your condition may help with the resentment. Infertility is a tough road and I would highly suggest counseling for the two of you. it is not one person's fault. you are in this together.
We had a long and difficult journey ourselves but sought out counseling and took the steps needed for each one of us to become healthier and tried to improve our odds.
Acupuncture and Fertility Blend vitamins have also been know to help, for both male and female.
best of luck to you.

[imagiccat]

I will ditto what hopeful2bemom said in regards to what IUI is and that you should continue checking out your options through the proper channels. (Doctors who specialize in this sort of thing). If you and your wife are around 26 years of age, frankly, you still have a few years to explore the possibility before most of the doors close and you have no choice but to use donor sperm or egg.

It sounds like you're not to that point, yet.

Now I will give you some advice on a more personal and less scientific level... the human level.

You say that you and she have lost three babies within the last year and a half, that you're both getting desperate, that you'd do anything and could love anything, and that she doesn't feel "whole" because there is no child... A lot of what you're feeling, (I suspect), is very typical of what couples feel when they're encountering infertility of any sort: grief, frustration, at your wit's end. Neither of you are abnormal for feeling any of this, so take heart and know that you're far from alone. In my opinion, it sounds like you're both still grieving over the miscarriages, (and that's normal!), and possibly haven't come to terms yet.

Ohhhhh, we modern people. We feel this need to grieve quickly and perfunctorily and then move on to the next attempt. We don't discuss the lingering pain, then people say all the wrong things, ("Well, at least you're young and you can try again!", or "Don't cry, you can always have another"). But it doesn't help the underlying sorrow, does it? And we have these expectations that if we "fail", we must immediately get back up on that horse and aim for that goal.

But having -- and losing -- babies doesn't always work that way. If you lost a five year old child, surely you wouldn't suddenly decide to get right back in the game and "replace" it, right?

You both know you want children together. That's a wonderful thing. But dang, dude, your wife probably doesn't even realize how much anguish she's holding inside her, and she certainly hasn't had time to assimilate all the options and possibilities. So if you both feel like you're falling apart, maybe you should try the next good idea: Seek counseling to help you deal with your feelings. Somewhere safe that you can both vent and let it out. There are grief support groups in a lot of places specifically for people going through this sort of thing, and those might be worth checking out.

Keep your wits about you and be determined to see this thing through, and chances are that you will have a baby.

But this fertility/infertility situation... *sigh*... It's not an instant gratification game.

Take your time, weigh your options, and proceed forward. You'll both figure it out together, and then you can figure out your future and your children together.

Best wishes!

[infertilitynovice]

First , and second...so sorry to hear about the ulcerative colitis. I have a very good friend who had a surgery to create a "J pouch" for this condition when she was 13.

My husband and I had to make this tough decision too. He had a vasectomy years ago when his youngest was born. His vasectomy was so extensive that a reversal wasn't a great option for us. We were told IVF/ICSI would be about 20K, so that option was out too. After much discussion and counseling, we decided that IUI with donor sperm would be our best option. I, too, had a the more difficult time with that decision. His oldest son isn't his biologically. He is his ex's son and has been in his life since he was just a few months old. He adopted him when he was 5. Needless to say, my husband's love is not tied to biology. It sounds like yours is not either.

Yes, the act of becoming pregnant through ART procedures is not exactly romantic, but still a life is being created with love. I wish it didn't have to be that way, but now I know it doesn't really matter. My husband and I are having a baby together. He was there for conception, he helped me through my morning sickness, he's gone out at inopportune times to get foods I'm craving, he's been there for all the ultrasounds, and now he sits patiently with his hand on my belly waiting for our daughter to kick...all the stuff a daddy does.

In the back of my mind I do wonder what this baby will look like...me or the donor. We're not telling anyone about using a donor, so I'm a little concerned that my husband's family will say something if she doesn't look like them. But, I also know that looks are random and it happens all the time that a baby gets great-granddad's big nose or ears, or great-great-grandma's flaming red hair. We matched the donors general characteristics to my husband, so I also know that I shouldn't worry that much.

Of course, I would have prefered that this baby was my husband's flesh and blood, but it is what it is and we couldn't be more thrilled about this little girl that will be all ours in just a few more months!!!

I would suggest that you and your wife talk to an RE about all of your options (perhaps you might have enough in a sample, post-wash, to combine your sperm with a donor's for the IUI) and then talk with a reproductive counselor. A child is a child and biology has less to do with it these days.

Good luck to both of you. I hope that you're able to go into "remission" again soon.

[claydos66]

I agree with the medication thing. Unfortunately, the only way to keep it in remission is to either be on drugs, steroids, immunosuppressants and so on. Each one more dangerous than the next. It sucks being in the spot I am in.
As far as seeking advice from a counsler, I agree. She is soo depressed and so hurt that she doesn't want to go.

I do have an appointment at the end of july to see a urologist. I do have my specialty doc. performming a testosterone test as a quick check to see whats going on. If that's normal, then the assumption is drugs are kicking my butt. Even if I do wait the time it taks for me to ween off the drugs, I still have to wait three months, so it is more and more stressful until 3+ ween off time.

[Bufton]

My husband and I are currently doing IUI's with donor sperm after 4 years of trying and treatments for him. The donor was absolutely his idea. IVF/ICSI was our only option and neither of us were "feeling" that as an option. Of course, it took me some time to get over the fact that we couldn't have our biological child. After we decided that the donor was the way to go, I started to get excited again about something that was just really becoming a bad situation. We BOTH became excited again. My husband, like you, could love any child under any circumstances.
I feel bad for you two. I think you're caught in a vicious circle. You really need to get your heads in the same place before you make any decisions. You seem like an amazing, supportive husband. Good luck to you!

[janehill]

Oh boy. As others have said, please, please, please talk your wife into seeing a counselor with you. You both have some difficult issues to work out - perhaps more so than the infertility.

I don't know how you can avoid feeling stressed. Please correct if I am wrong but I read it like this:

1. You have an incurable condition (that's pretty serious) and when you have flares, the steroids relieve it but diminish your sperm production/quality. Don't see how you could do anything more.
2. You are eager to have a child with your wife and don't care if it's genetically yours or not (implying sperm donor). But your wife refuses because it wouldn't be your genetic child. So that leaves you in a bind, I'm sure.
3. She feels resentful of your condition. Okay, I'm sure you feel more resentful and sad than anyone.
4. And if the IUI's don't work out (which, given the above, seems difficult), she wants you to have a vasectomy? Can you elaborate on the rationale for this? I mean, is there a legitimate reason why a 26 year old man who is in a marriage where both parties want to have a child would EVER have a vasectomy?

Unless she's willing to wait until your health improves (and you don't need the steroids), there really is no solution.

My heart goes out to you because you're in a no-win situation. Again, some much-needed counseling is in order.

Much luck to you (you're a very good man).

[claydos66]

I am claydos66's wife. He shared this website with me this morning, as well as his thread about our fertility issues.

I love love love that he (on his own) found this website as a support for himself. I myself have my own fertility forum that i go to.

he did leave a lot out about our "journey" And some of his fertility issues as well as my own and that is fine. Nobody needs to know everything.

He is a amazing supportive husband who would do and does do anything for me. And for this i am grateful.

As far as counseling goes. I have my own ideas about that. I think it is a great thing and at some point yes it may be a good thing for us. Not right now.

And as far as me wanting him to get a vasectomy, which janehill pointed out is this - His CHRONIC illness is not a fun one. I have seen him go through hell over and over again. I am now going through it with him again and it is affecting the both of us. I will stay by his side and take care of him and love him. But as i said before it is a chronic illness that can pop up at any given time. If he does not have any issues with donor sperm (which he does not. he is actually more on board with it than i am.) then lets get a vacesectomy done so he does not pass this illness on to our children or grandchildren. ( which he does believe in) That is where i was coming from with the whole vasectomy thing.

I and (WE) are NOT against using donor sperm. I think it is a great thing. And we actually picked out a donor whom we both chose together. Claydos66 is more adamant about using the donor because of his condition as well as the need for BOTH of us to have a child now. So again as i just said. I am NOT against using donor sperm. I just (naturally) am coming to terms with it all and realizing that this donor is not my husband and essentially i am having a (biological) child with a stranger. How lucky am i that my amazing husband is going to be the father!!!

JANEHILL, i do agree with you. My husband is a very good man. i am truly lucky to have him.

There is always more than meets the eye. please remember this.

Thank you all for the kind words of encouragement for my husband. I am soo glad that he found this site.

-Claydos66's wife!

[janehill]

Well, as they say....there is his side, her side and the truth.

Your husband joined the group as you say "on his own" and sought support and understanding - and received that from a group of very kind and well-intentioned ladies.

No one can comment on more than what is shared. And as such the comment about a vasectomy was initiated by your spouse and certainly not in the context of he wanting the procedure. I think that's a pretty meaningful and personal decision one must be prepared to make without the pressure of their spouse - particularly a 26 year old man. But perhaps that's just my personal code.

Further and foremost, I'm sure you appreciate the ability to discuss, question, comment and vent on your own fertility forum without your husband's intrusion or correction. Consider that he may benefit from the same experience. Used properly, in fact, reading his posts may help you understand his perspective and concerns, which could prove more valuable than using this forum as an opportunity to publically "correct" him.

And please do reconsider the counseling.

[claydos66]

janehill,
I do not appreciate your response to my wife. You have taken my issue WAAAYY out of context and if you read it carefully coming from a guys perspective very early in the morning and in my overwhelmed state, with everything going on including a converstion my wife and I had till 2 am in the morning, you seem to have thought that I meant to make my wife look bad. That is the last thing I would want to do.

I would like to point out that I came on here on my own looking for ways to encourage my wife and make her feel better.

Yes this post is to help people. This includes my wife. We share everything with each other including thoughts, feelings, and yes even our posts to other people on advice. I normally do not extend the hand of forums due to this EXACT reason that someone takes something out of context such as yourself and runs with it.

Everyone else has shared with me and others viewing this thread their personal stories of using IUI / IVF with donor eggs or sperm and how they have coped with it.

To think, you would be more sympathetic about this issue doing treatments by yourself with another persons eggs and sperm. I'm sure you have lost ones yourself and you know how it feels. So please, lay off the inensative remarks about my wife and I. I came to this forum for help and you have pushed us into a corner.

Both my wife and I came onto the forum to see if anyone had replied back to me on my original post and when we read your first comment, my wife asked me if it would be ok if she responded. I sat next to her as she wrote her response and I agreed with everything that was in it 500%.

That being said, we both thank you for your great concern and my wife is commenting on what a strong woman you must be. My mother in law had kids young and is only about a couple years older than you. We can't imagine her going through this by herself right now.

And I mean with the thought of her having Grand-kids right now amazes her. Hopefully it will happen sooner than later. You never know.

My wife means the world to me. You publicly put her on trial for something that you have no idea about. We work out our own problems and talk like husband and wife. We have discussed counsling in the past and currently we have decided to wait on it until we we feel it is appropriate. It does not mean we are not going.

Again, thank you all for your wonderful responses.

[hopefulfor#2]

My husband & I are going through something very very similar, and while I'm the female half of the couple, I can absolutely relate to you.
We are blessed with a 2yr old daughter, who it took us 3 WEEKS to conceive. So we always thought Baby #2 would take just as fast.
Since our daughter was born, my husband was diagnosed with colitis. Over the past 15 months of Drs, urologists, etc etc, we have learned that it is the condition itself for him, not the medications, that have made him azoospermic. He's taken months of clomid, he's drastically changed his diet, we have my cycles timed to what seems like the minute... and we've "tried" for 15 months now with no results. Our next step is for him to have TESE surgery to see if there's sperm that they can remove & freeze... and then take the frozen sperm to do IVF with me. It's crazy. And it is stressful. And it creates tension btwn the 2 of us. And it's completely out of our control. It sounds like you have the right attitude of keeping an open mind of all options. I really feel like in situations like this, it takes a strong 1/2 of the couple to keep the other 1/2 going & motivated. The greatest thing is, you have options. Stay positive. Your colon health is just as important as anything else. You & your wife will raise a beautiful baby. How that baby gets to you will be an adventure, but you will raise a baby. Hang in there, you're not alone.

[claydos66]

thank you hopeful. that is EXACTLY what my wife and i needed to hear. Your kind words were perfect.

[jencat215]

wow. first let me say how incredibly sorry I am that you and DW had to go through these tragic losses. I have been there myself, 2 m/c's and an ectopic that ruptured my tube and almost cost me my life. And I do know the urgent desire to have a child immediately. I know all of our situations are different, but just never ever give up hope . Exactly a year after my ectopic, I got pregnant again and this time it has been successful.


Now I know you said you weren't interested in IVF and it sounds like DW is just coming around to donor sperm. I don't know what your sperm stats are, but, and this is just a suggestion, is it possible for you to take a vacation, relax, just step back from TTC for just enough time for you to get off medication and get your sperm counts back up, then freeze some sperm at that time or try an IUI with your sperm (fresh)? My DH and I got pregnant on a natural cycle, while we were waiting to do IVF. We had so much stress with our losses, with IUIs, with waiting for IVF, that on this particular cycle, even though we did go to check for which ovary was producing a follicle (remember, I only have one tube, so only one ovary is useful for conception w/o IVF), we didn't feel any stress or even think about that cycle being a bust because we knew that the next cycle we were doing IVF and we would be successful.
Who knows, maybe the universe shifted for us and gave us our miracle.

Anyway, I guess the point I am trying to make (and yes, I do tend to ramble) is that if a biological child is important to you (and I mean the collective you... as in you and DW), and you guys have every right to want that, then maybe there are other options. You didn't state if you were seeing a specialist, or an RE, or anything, but if you are not, it might be worth a consult.
And, with your losses, there is no guarantee that this won't happen again with donor sperm. Has your wife had a multiple miscarriage workup? RPL, recurring pregnancy loss, is a condition that doesn't necessarily mean chromosome issues in the embryo. There are many blood disorders and immunological disorders in the woman that could cause the m/c's. I had my work-up after 2 m/c's and we found that I had a blood disorder that baby aspirin and folgard, along with first trimester heparin injections, seem to have helped. And that is a easy fix. If your wife hasn't had the work-up, I would highly recommend it asap.

One more thing then the rambling will stop. There is not a definite link for UC being hereditary. Yes, it can run it families, but it doesn't always and there has been no gene linkage found.

Good luck to you and DW.

[claydos66]

Jencat,
Thank you for your advice.



When I first came here looking for support and wrote this thread it was a extremely difficult emotional time for DW and myself. We had literally just found out what was going on and both of us overreacted and were extremely irrational and mentally drained. What i had not wrote was that we were also in the midst of a death in the family as well as a close family member who was diagnosed with cancer. Things were crazy for us and we both snapped. Neither of us knew what was going to happen and we were both so scared to death. Things have calmed down considerably since then and we are doing great now. It took a lot of talking (to each other and to others who have been in similar situations) We joined a local fertility support group and we buddied up with another couple who are going through the exact same thing.

after a lot of soul searching and talking we came to the conclusion to use the donor sperm. i dont want to chance passing this terrible disease onto my children or grandchildren.I could not bear to watch them deal with the awful things i have dealt with. And seeing as many in my family do have this condition ( more family members than i thought! i did a lot of talking to my mother about the family health history.. it was shocking. It does seem to be a genetic thing with us) i would rather not pass it on. I can love any child. and regardless of anything, this baby will be mine. I will love him/her with my whole being. And i am excited to start this process.

The past 2 months have been hard on both of us but i am extremely happy to say that it has brought us together in ways i never imagined possible.


The irrationalness and the craziness in the begining of this was awful and devestating. we both said things we regret now. I bring this up because i want other men like myself to realize that this is as much of a devestating awful journey to your mates as it is to you. You can and will work through it. Do not dwell on what your mate is saying to you.. or what you are saying to your mate. Its sadness, hurt and being afraid of the unknown that brings these feelings and thoughts up. It will get better.

My wife has been seeing a RE. And we are just about to start our first cycle with donor sperm. The IUI should be coming up here in the next couple weeks. I am excited to start this process.


I find it sad that some people (people whom you would think would understand the hurt this is initially causing everyone) feel the need to attack and read into things that they know NOTHING about. I thank all of you who have had kind words of encouragement for us.

Thank you again. I will keep you all updated as to what is going on.