[J9yinyang]

I'm sure this is just normal marriage pain, but I wanted to vent. There are times when I wonder why in the h*ll I'm bothering to put myself through all of this, trying to get pregnant. It'll help if you all have some history.

My parents divorced when I was 3. Before that, they'd had a very volatile relationship. They screamed at each other all the time. Shortly after the divorce was final (which was also ugly), my dad remarried. The woman he married was a nightmare (bipolar, abusive both verbally and physically), and was allowed free rein by my father to do whatever she deemed "necessary" to me, but not my sister. My mother and my sister were always at odds, and my mom spent very little time with us, so I was my sister's favorite target for meanness. Finally, Mom couldn't take my sister anymore, and sent us to live with my dad when I was 9 (Dad wouldn't take only my sister). Until I was 16 and started fighting back, my stepmother beat the crap out of me every day. She threw me down the stairs, dragged me out of bed and through the house by my hair because I hadn't emptied the dishwasher the night before, etc. My sister and father both preferred to act like I wasn't there. At 4 I had been diagnosed with ADD, and put on ritalin. My mother said it made me act like a zombie, so she took me off of it. I was never medicated again. I also had a higher-than-normal IQ as a child, so it took more to keep me busy. So, I developed a bit of a talking problem. My father says I have "diarrhea of the mouth". The more uncomfortable I am, or tired, or excited about a topic, or whatever, I talk. Almost incessantly. And if the person I'm talking to seems bored or annoyed by how much I'm talking, I can't help it, I talk more.

At 28, I hadn't had a date in 3 years, and hadn't really "dated" anyone in 7 years. And I was (am) obese. After years of being told no man would ever want me, because I was fat and talked too much, I decided that maybe that was true, and I should just get used to being alone, and make myself like it. I bought a house, instead of paying rent the rest of my life, and prepared to just be an auntie to my niece (9) and two nephews (6 & 4). Well, that didn't work out that well, either, because my sister and I still had problems getting along, and she got tired of me hanging around her house and spending time with her kids all the time (unless, of course, she needed house work or yard work done, or if she wanted a night off without the kids, that is). The kids adored me, and I thought, with them in my life, maybe I'd be ok. But my sister started hinting that I should not come over so much, and even told me I should get a life. So here I was, in my new house, by myself. I was lonely. So I got online. And I met the hubby. He lived in New York, I lived in Michigan. So when he moved to be near me, he moved in with me. A little over a year later, we were married. Some days, I think that I only married him because I wanted to have kids, and he was the only one who was ever going to ask me. I love him, but sometimes I think I was better off alone.

Now down to why I ask if I want to breed with him. I have had a hard life. And I can list the reasons why I really don't know if I should be someone's mom. But at least I have control over my own behavior. But I can't control his, and sometimes his behavior reminds me so much of my dad's (or a petulant child), I really worry about having him around "my" children. I can see myself turning into this witchy control freak wife, who can't stop nagging him and correcting his behavior. And I don't want to live like that, but I don't know how well I'll do giving up control. I know how badly certain things a parent says or does can hurt a sensitive child firsthand, and I couldn't stand it if he did that to "my" child.

What brings this up is, hubby and I were watching American Idol last night, and after it was over, he commented on how surprised he was that one of the contestants was in the bottom three. So I expressed my opinion about why he was down there, and why he wasn't the best singer. And I was probably long-winded about it. Of course, considering the entire conversation took less than 5 minutes, you can judge for yourself. Anyway, about 4 1/2 minutes in, my husband started singing a song... over top of me talking to him. I stopped for a minute, he stopped, then I started talking again, and he continued to sing. I was incensed, and yelled at him **** You! This isn't the first time he's either talked over me or interrupted me to change the subject to something he wanted to complain about or whatever, so I was mad. And it hurt my feelings that he couldn't even feign interest, but chose to be rude, instead. So he said "Why would I want to listen to you go on and on about this? It's boring!" And I responded by saying that, every time he gets on a 3 hour dissertation about conditions and battle strategies during the Civil War, it's not like I'm enthralled, but I'm not rude to him about it. He eventually apologized, but my point is, not only was he rude, he went so far as to DEFEND it, and stayed mad at ME for getting angry about it for half an hour before he admitted he was wrong.

Maybe I should go and get marriage counseling, but I honestly don't think that I can change his behavior at this stage in his life. He's not a bad person. He's actually really great most of the time. And I'm sure I'll go home this evening and explain to him how he hurt my feelings, and he'll be very sorry. But it won't change anything. Another week or month from now, he'll do it again. And I'll be hurt again. And if I can't trust him not to hurt me, how could I possibly want to have children with him?

[jenntrav94]

Jenine,

I'm not a councelor or anything like that, and I do try not to be a judging person. But I think you answered your own question:

Maybe I should go and get marriage counseling, but I honestly don't think that I can change his behavior at this stage in his life. He's not a bad person. He's actually really great most of the time. And I'm sure I'll go home this evening and explain to him how he hurt my feelings, and he'll be very sorry. But it won't change anything. Another week or month from now, he'll do it again. And I'll be hurt again. And if I can't trust him not to hurt me, how could I possibly want to have children with him?

__________________
Jenine
35 yo, TTC 4 1/2 yrs. -- HSG (rt tube blocked), Hashimoto's, obese
Initial Clinic Appt. April 10 - Blood tests, poss. endo, doc was a jerk
Next Clinic Appt. May 1 - New doc!!


In my opinion if your that unsure you probably should do some kind of theropy before conceiveing. The way I see it you still have time to have children, I wouldn't stop taking meds or anything like that I would just try to "stop" before he is finished.

If you don't want the expenses of theropy then maybe talking to him about it and being compeletely honest with him like you are with us. Tell him everything as to how you feel about being scared. Scared of being a mom, scared of him being a dad. Have you told him ALL about your rough childhood? Maybe he will understand. I recommend Dr. Phil's relationship rescue book. Your relationship might not be in danger yet, but it wouldn't hurt for him to read it. It may help him understand your feelings and point of view's more! I think its worth a shot!

~jennie~

[J9yinyang]

Yeah, Jennie, I'm as honest with him as I am with everyone. And I don't know that I DO have time to wait until everything is perfect, because I'm 35, and POF usually happens in my family around 37 or 38. So if I want to have more than one child, then I'm in a time crunch. And it could still be YEARS before they find out what's wrong with me, if ever. That's part of my stress.

But you're also right that I answered my own question.

[einstein]

Hi Jenine,

I had no clue that you had such a rough life. First of all, I commend you for being able to rise above it all. You are a worthwhile, decent, kind, loving human being (who always has kind things to say on this board) and you deserve happiness. No matter what you were told growing up, you deserve to be happy and healthy.

I agree that marriage counseling is the way to go. My DH and I did counseling BEFORE we got married. Seriously. We had such problems while we were dating that we sought counseling. All we did was fight and argue before. Even breaking up didn't work. Let me tell you -- it brought us back together 110 percent. I highly recommend it. If nothing else, you should seek counseling yourself -- even if your DH refuses to go. There are some obvious issues that you should talk over with a therapist to try and resolve before you even bring DH into it.

I am sending you a big hug, hon. You really deserve it!!!

[J9yinyang]

Thank you, Karen. I appreciate that.

[slobin]

Jenine,

I have no answers and feel that any "advice" I give will sound trite and there is nothing I can think of that you haven't already. But I do want to offer my support and commend you for who you are now, given your very traumatic past. I am always impressed with your thoughtful, intelligent, insightful posts and I feel that you deserve much happiness and to be treated well because you obvioulsy have a lot to offer your husband, the world and your future child.

I have benefitted from therapy and DH and I had one session together (for a specific issue that came up) and we found it helpful.

Relationships are hard enough without IF, and those of us cursed with IF have that extra burden on our relationships.

I wish I had something better to say, but I just wanted to offer my support and let you know that I think you deserve the best, and that you have the kindness and skills to work out your marital problems.

Slobin

[J9yinyang]

Well, this was from a few weeks ago, of course, and I've gotten over being mad at him. I go through periods of this, where I'm so sure that I made a bad decision getting married, half for the problems I have and half for the problems he has. But then we manage to work things out for a while. Then he forgets and does the same thing all over again, and I get even more upset, because we've already had that discussion. Anyway, I have a feeling that my marriage with him will always have peaks and valleys because I have a constant inner conflict with always trying to please, then feeling unappreciated. I'm sure it's more me than him, but I'm not willing to compromise, so I make my own life harder. Dad always said I go about everything the hard way.... I guess that's a problem.

[jf5505]

No marriage is perfect no matter what people say, and it is very hard to compromise sometimes, I myself felt therapy gave me new perspective on situations and I felt really good when I would leave, maybe give it a try....in the end you have to measure your happiness, if your happy with him more than not, then your lucky...my therapist said that we are two corse stones and will rub against each other over time and soon become so smooth...and when you are throwing IF in the mix it only makes everything more complicated. By the way...after reading your story, I wonder why you don't need a license to be a mother and father, I was so angry at your stepmom...I could just scream, could you ever forgive her?

[J9yinyang]

Um, no. I'd like to say I'm a bigger person than that, but no, I'll never forgive her. And I can't forgive my father for letting it happen, either. I didn't even mention some of the worse things that she did, but believe me, she is a monster. And she's not really out of my life, either. My Dad divorced her about 11 years ago now, but she's still getting alimony from him, and will until she dies, even though he's now retired (he's 66) and only gets Social Security. He can't support himself, but since he's remarried, the courts have decided it's fair for her to support him, and for Carol to get every penny he gets in Social Security, which is totally unfair because he earned that money working since he was 16 years old. And it's not fair to Peggy, either, his current wife. Poor woman both has to live with my cranky dad AND be financially bankrupted by his ex-wife? Not a great deal. Anyway, my Dad has on occasion had to borrow money (money that we will probably not get back ever, because he's a pauper, and doesn't even have any money should he ever need to go into a home, because of that witch) to pay her the alimony the courts say he owes her. Right now he's almost $8000 in arrears again, and just keeps sinking deeper and deeper. So if and when my father can no longer take care of himself, my sister and I will have to deal with the financial burden ourselves, just because she's a vindictive b*tch and a talented liar. The biggest joke about this whole thing is that she's getting all of this alimony because she told the judge my dad abused HER while they were married. What a LAUGH!! An abuser lies and makes themself the victim, and she's going to end up ruining my dad and my whole family!!!

Sorry, went on a tirade there.

[alinahov]

Dear Jenine,

I wish I could say something to make you feel better!

I too think you are a very good person who probably has no clue of HOW GOOD YOU REALLY ARE! That's the problem with smart people, they tend to be to rough on themselves and yet don't give enough credit to themselves.

You know, I had a father who drunk all his life. I actually remember him being drunk more than any other way...

He was verbally very abusive to every body and specially, to my mom, because she achieved more in a
life than he did. I never could understand why my mom put up with all that, but she never left him. Anyway, I saved his life more than once, I set by his bedside 24 hours a day for 2 months when he was in ICU due to perforated stomach ulcer and bleeding after surgery. I did everything, from enema to bedbath, from injections to bedtime stories (yeah, that too). When his blood pressure went too high I took him to best doctors, bought best medications and for 2 weeks i would give him shots every 2 hours day or night.

2 Years ago I went back to Armenia to see everybody (I'm VERY close to my mom and always felt it was my duty to protect her). My dad was drunk again all 3 weeks I was there, never even asked me how I was, or anything (only his slimy kisses sometimes when he had enough to drink and telling me I was a light of his life...)

So, one day he came home with severe stomach pain and I thought it's a new ulcer or some thing like that, so again I gave him few shots, called 911 and as I was giving him his shot he got very angry and cursed me of never having children...

I think you could imagine how I felt...

Few minutes later he was dead (rupture of aortic aneurism) and Iwas performing CPR when paramedics arrived...

When my first IVF failed, I was very angry with everything and specially with him, because of what he said. It took me a year to lick my wound to a manageable pain level.

Than I thought the only person who is affected by this the most it's me, and to be able to restore my inner peace I have to do something. I came back to Bible.

I forgave him. I went to church, lit the candle just for him and I forgave him. I'm not angry with him anymore, just sad.

Sometimes I too feel like I married my DH just to brake free from hell at home, but now I think maybe it was meant tobe. We were meant to meet because only together we could heal eachothers wounds. I too fight with him sometimes and I even told him once that I'm not sure I want a child with him. By the way, I met mine online too!

I think because I'm a strong person too (like you are) and I'm used to taking care of myself and not being dependant of anyone and he wants toprotect me and shelter me and irritates me with it sometimes.

I learned to let my self be "just a woman" with him and tell him "do whatever you think it's better to do" (I have to confess, every time I say that I have a sarcastic smile inside) It seems to work.

I just think if you only could if not forgive but put it behind you, like a page of a book you already have red, because there are so many interesting pages ahead, it's time to open new one and see, what good things are to come your way. They will, all you have to do is believe and they will.
Wecan't change our past, but we can at least try to forbid it to poison our future.

I hope and pray that you find understanding with your DH and make yourself even better than you are by stepping over that past to a future with hope and joy.
You will make a very-very good mommy, don't even doubt!

Sincerely

[wewishforbaby]

Wow, i'm totally blown away by your story.

Your step-mom sure is a piece of work and for your dad to have to continue to pay and then when he goes, you guys have to pay the burden is inconceivable to me! I would bring her up on charges for all the abuse she did to me as a child! You and your sister should take her up in court, maybe you both have some recourse.

In regards to your husband, it really sounds to me like you are both going through normal adjustments. Unfortunately, when you talk to people they make you think that marriage should be this perfect set up...one shouldn't argue, fight or go through hardships, but I find that hardtimes are very normal in relationships...it actually makes you grow.

now, if you are constantly insulting each other, being physically or mentally abusive, then it's time to go, but if your husband tunes you out sometimes and you get into your arguments, then that's a whole other situation.

If you are second guessing ttc with your DH, then I'd say go see a counselor either together or by yourself, explore your feelings a bit and go from there.

Good luck with everything.

[jnem]

Dear Jenine,

OH BOY YOU TOUCHED A HEART STRING FOR ME..PLEASE don't take this as rude or condisending as it comes from the heart...You see Jenine my own mother had (has) a similiar story to yours and from the eyes of her first child I will say to you what I would have said to her before she had me...GET THERAPY MOM! Not just for your marraige but for you and you future children! You've been thru too much not to need it. My mother doesn't stop talking EVER! And if you think you are sensitive to your husband not listening to you what are you going to do when your children won't listen? My mother did exactly what you said; turn into a controlling nagging intolerant woman living by herself in a studio apt. but then it got worse after she alienated everyone around her she became a stalker to me and my DH and DD ...she spies on me, she calls my doctors, she goes through my home when I am not there, she calls my house umpteen times a day leaving 1/2 hour voice mail messages. She has a compulsion to give her opinion/instruction on every topic, subject no matter major or miniscule of an issue. I love my mom but no one can stay in a room with her past that 4 1/2 minute rant that your DH cut in at. My 4 yr old DD her own granddaughter rolls her eyes and walks away. Jenine this is a horrible, horrible way to live so please please get therapy if not to save your marraige but to save you relationships with your future children. For the record, I commend you for being able to carry on and make a life for yourself BUT the damage of your childhood runs way DEEP-too deep to escape without scars. You don't want to pass the rippling waves over to your children, it would be best if you delt with issues before TTC. Good luck to you I wish you, DH and your future children all the best.

Jen