[desperate]

Hi Guys,

I am having one of those days where I can't stop crying. And crying. And crying. It doesn't help that it's my 8th wedding anniversary today and my birthday is in a few days -- and still no baby. And nobody seems to understand how much pain I'm in.

Our doctor thinks another round of IVF will yeild another BFN, and doesn't think there is anything that will improve our embryo quality. We are waiting for consultations with other RE's but our wait for some is over a month away.

Both sets of parents are urging us NOT to waste our money on another round of IVF (we are out of pocket and another failed cycle will really sink us financially). They espeically don't want us to spend money on more expensive tests that won't actually help us get pregnant. They are urging us to spend our money on adoption instead.

We are so confused. Do we put ourselves out of our misery and adopt but give up our dream of a bio child? Or try again and hope it works? We want a bio child more than anything in the world and the reality that our dream is dying is killing us both. We just don't know what to do? I'm looking for other stories out there where people had similar problems and trying again got them their . Or anyone who had bad embies and did something to improve them???


I guess I'm just looking for hope. Or at the very least, a reality check.

[Lawyerlady]

I am so sorry you are going through this. IF is just the worst.

Has your RE given you any sense of why he thinks you have poor embryo quality? You and DH are both really young. I wouldn't give up without some sort of explanation as to why he thinks another fresh cycle wouldn't yield better results. Have you considered switching clinics? I am convinced that much of the reason my first two cycles failed is that my RE used far too conservative of a protocol, which led to less follicle development and all immature follicles at retrieval, which then led to two BFNs. A second opinion certainly wouldn't hurt.

[mia23]

I know that a lot of women on here have begun taking Royal Jelly to improve egg quality. A few have gotten pregnant naturally after failed IVF's . I know a girl on one of the threads who just had her 3rd IVF with the best looking embies since taking Royal Jelly. I will bump the thread for you . It is about $20 a bottle and if you are not allergic it wont hurt anything. I am so sorry you are going thru this . I am by no means an expert and have not done IVF yet but thought I would pass on the info just in case. And maybe switching to a different clinic would help. I have heard the best things about C.C.R.M. Again good luck!

[MissKris]

Have you read the royal jelly thread? I took that, combined with anti-oxidants (COQ-10) and acupuncture to improve egg quality.

I agree with lawyerlady. Wait until your consults before you give up on your embryos. You might be surprised by what they have to say.

[mia23]

I believe the Royal Jelly is even suppossed to be good for sperm.

[8kitts]

Hi Lisa, I just read your post and I don't think you should give up yet, I've seen threads w/women trying more than you did that finally end up w/

If you haven't already, read the Infertility Cure, it will definetely give you some insight and HOPE. You can order it on Amazon for less than the regular price.

Get a few RE opinions, and don't give up yet. I understand how costly it is and upsetting and frustrating.

You are very young still and haven't mentioned any serious health issues. I really don't believe this is the end of the road for you. I am 42 years old and I am not giving up yet on my eggs, and they are a lot older than yours!!!!

We have another thread that I started called "Support and discussion after BFN", please feel free to join us to vent and for great support, it's a really nice thread, and we have really bonded and have all been through the sadness. I cried for days, but I'm back up to bat with the support of the rest of the girls on the thread.
I'm taking royal jelly and considering acupuncture too. Hang in there!!! to you and DH

Sherry

[davea]

The best way to improve your embryos is to go to a BETTER LAB!

The media and nutrients they feed those young embryos is critical to development! So is the technique of ICSI and AH.

It is worth the money to go to the best lab possible!

Improving the intrinsic quality of sperm and eggs is more difficult - since a lot of that is related to genetics.

Also - trying different stimulation protocols also helps.

We went from having 2 bad looking morula on day 5 at one lab to having 2 or 3 high quality blastocysts on day 5 at a better lab! Same sperm, same egg, a few dietary changes (wife gave up being vegetarian) and the last cycle worked.

Don't give up!!!!!

[nursesunshine]

Originally Posted by davea

The best way to improve your embryos is to go to a BETTER LAB!

I agree. Go with the absolute best you can. I hope you find some answers and are able to do a consult or 2 with clinics that are rated well. I'm so sorry you are dealing with this. It is a very hard thing to go through. Hugs to you!

[azariah08]

Well with the number of eggs you are having fertilize, I would hypothesize one of two things is happening:
-Your lab isn't the greatest and therefore the embryos aren't living

OR

-It is poor quality and either can't develop or won't be capable of implanting once transferred.

Often egg quantity and quality are correlated. Typically (I think) if you have a lot of eggs there is a reasonable chance that a few will be good quality.

Did you discuss egg donation at all? Its pricey, but maybe an option in your case. Kind of a bio child and at least you get to carry it which would be awesome.

[Vickie]

Desperate:

I am sorry you are feeling so down. This roller-coaster of infertility is a real-time hell on earth sometimes. It's a lot of things to think about - it's not easy. If you decide to stick with pursuing he path of bio child and If you ever have time to invest in reading a book - I could recommend Dr. Alan E. Beer's book "Is Your Body Baby-Friendly?" It is based of his research in reproductive immunology field for many years - he helped thousands of patients with unexplained infertility and recurrent miscarriages. There is also a center where his successors do the testing. It's a great resource with lots of answers.

[LGB]

Here are some ideas: I just had a consult with a new RE after our 1st failed cycle and I am a poor responder too. He wants to put me on 75 mg of DHEA for 2-3 months before starting another IVF cycle. I am not sure how I feel about it bc my acupuncturist said she doesn't agree with him and DHEA would not help me. Maybe you can ask the REs you are about to consult with about it.

He also recommended JuicePlus bc it's a high anti-oxidant. I drink green tea, eat organic, and do acupuncture too.

Another idea is to meet with as many REs as you feel comfortable with. My DH and I immediately set up consults with other local practices after our failed cycle bc we wanted to see what others could offer us, their ideas on protocols, any other tests to do, etc. before jumping right into a 2nd cycle. And so far our 1st consult was very enlightening bc he has a totally different take on which protocol he would use, he did an anti-ovarian antibody test that very day, and recommended DHEA. Totally fresh ideas from our current RE. And we have 2 more to go. I set up a free phone consult with SIRM who seems to be very cutting-edge; I think I read on a thread that you set one up with them too?

You may want to ask about the new Antagon/Antagonist Estrogen Priming Protocol. It is suppose to be good for poor responders and in progressive practices, they are replacing the Flare protocols with that one. I can email you some literature about it if you'd like.

Hang in there, we're all in this together even though it feels like a lonely road some days.

[8kitts]

Originally Posted by LGB

Here are some ideas: I just had a consult with a new RE after our 1st failed cycle and I am a poor responder too. He wants to put me on 75 mg of DHEA for 2-3 months before starting another IVF cycle. I am not sure how I feel about it bc my acupuncturist said she doesn't agree with him and DHEA would not help me. Maybe you can ask the REs you are about to consult with about it.

He also recommended JuicePlus bc it's a high anti-oxidant. I drink green tea, eat organic, and do acupuncture too.

Another idea is to meet with as many REs as you feel comfortable with. My DH and I immediately set up consults with other local practices after our failed cycle bc we wanted to see what others could offer us, their ideas on protocols, any other tests to do, etc. before jumping right into a 2nd cycle. And so far our 1st consult was very enlightening bc he has a totally different take on which protocol he would use, he did an anti-ovarian antibody test that very day, and recommended DHEA. Totally fresh ideas from our current RE. And we have 2 more to go. I set up a free phone consult with SIRM who seems to be very cutting-edge; I think I read on a thread that you set one up with them too?

You may want to ask about the new Antagon/Antagonist Estrogen Priming Protocol. It is suppose to be good for poor responders and in progressive practices, they are replacing the Flare protocols with that one. I can email you some literature about it if you'd like.

Hang in there, we're all in this together even though it feels like a lonely road some days.

I would be very interested in that protocol you mentioned, could you send it to me? Thanks.

[LGB]

I have it in a word document, can you PM me your email address and I can email it to you? I got it from some girls who are being treated by SIRM, and I think it's also on SIRM's website. I came across it, and then the next day I had a consult with a new RE and that was the first thing out of his mouth "I want to put you on the ACEP protocol and try DHEA too. We've been having very good results with it". It was really weird how he read my mind!
I think Cathy (I can't remember her exact forum name) did it too and she's pg!!!

[ScootiesGirl]

Originally Posted by LGB

I have it in a word document, can you PM me your email address and I can email it to you? I got it from some girls who are being treated by SIRM, and I think it's also on SIRM's website. I came across it, and then the next day I had a consult with a new RE and that was the first thing out of his mouth "I want to put you on the ACEP protocol and try DHEA too. We've been having very good results with it". It was really weird how he read my mind!
I think Cathy (I can't remember her exact forum name) did it too and she's pg!!!

cathyh is her forum name and I'm sure she'll share her success story with you. I too am on DHEA and my personal experience has been a positive one.

[alisa]

Originally Posted by LGB

Here are some ideas: I just had a consult with a new RE after our 1st failed cycle and I am a poor responder too. He wants to put me on 75 mg of DHEA for 2-3 months before starting another IVF cycle. I am not sure how I feel about it bc my acupuncturist said she doesn't agree with him and DHEA would not help me. Maybe you can ask the REs you are about to consult with about it.

He also recommended JuicePlus bc it's a high anti-oxidant. I drink green tea, eat organic, and do acupuncture too.

Another idea is to meet with as many REs as you feel comfortable with. My DH and I immediately set up consults with other local practices after our failed cycle bc we wanted to see what others could offer us, their ideas on protocols, any other tests to do, etc. before jumping right into a 2nd cycle. And so far our 1st consult was very enlightening bc he has a totally different take on which protocol he would use, he did an anti-ovarian antibody test that very day, and recommended DHEA. Totally fresh ideas from our current RE. And we have 2 more to go. I set up a free phone consult with SIRM who seems to be very cutting-edge; I think I read on a thread that you set one up with them too?

You may want to ask about the new Antagon/Antagonist Estrogen Priming Protocol. It is suppose to be good for poor responders and in progressive practices, they are replacing the Flare protocols with that one. I can email you some literature about it if you'd like.

Hang in there, we're all in this together even though it feels like a lonely road some days.

Can you sent it to me too please??? Thanks so much!