[lvtchr]

Hi! I'm new to IVF and to this board and would like some advice. A bit of history...I'm 32, DH is 31; TTC for 3 yrs. Did 2 IUI w/injectables and both BFN. Up to now we've been "unexplained". We started an IVF cycle in early June (BCPs then Follistim/Luveris) but I only made 5 follies. Doc says that my FSH was elevated this month (17.8 vs. earlier results between 3-5) so that combined with my poor response makes me a "poor responder" and means I have lower quality eggs.

Does this make sense? Does a one-time high FSH value and lack of response mean my eggs really suck? For our next cycle she wants to try the microflare protocol w/lupron but she's already talking about a potential need to use donor eggs in the future if this cycle doesn't work out. This seems extreme to me since we haven't even officially tried IVF. Advice???

[Bri01]

I was a slow responder as well. I stimed for 3 weeks prior to my retrival and eventual transfer back. I was told about the possibility of using DE but I ended up getting pregnant with my own that very cycle. We did however do the IVF with ICSI.

[Brooklyn]

Did they stop your cycle with five follies? All I had was five follies and I ended up with five eggs of which four fertilized and made it to day 5. I had a day 5 transfer with a beautiful blast and a morula and I'm 6 weeks pregnant.

I was scared they were going to 'shut down' my cycle but obviously thrilled they didn't.

It can happen with a low follie count.

[ekb88]

Hi lvtchr. Let me refer you to two great sites. The first one has alot of great info for those newly facing a high fsh diagnosis - High FSH Info

The second one is a great forum for women in the same boat - New High FSH Support Forum

There are many women who've gone on to be successful, even with high fsh. It may take longer, but it's not impossible.

Find yourself a doctor who is "high fsh friendly". It doesn't sound like your current doctor is. Best wishes to you.

[houston]

Originally Posted by lvtchr

Hi! I'm new to IVF and to this board and would like some advice. A bit of history...I'm 32, DH is 31; TTC for 3 yrs. Did 2 IUI w/injectables and both BFN. Up to now we've been "unexplained". We started an IVF cycle in early June (BCPs then Follistim/Luveris) but I only made 5 follies. Doc says that my FSH was elevated this month (17.8 vs. earlier results between 3-5) so that combined with my poor response makes me a "poor responder" and means I have lower quality eggs.

Does this make sense? Does a one-time high FSH value and lack of response mean my eggs really suck? For our next cycle she wants to try the microflare protocol w/lupron but she's already talking about a potential need to use donor eggs in the future if this cycle doesn't work out. This seems extreme to me since we haven't even officially tried IVF. Advice???

I had the same thing happen. I knew I had a slightly elevated FSH (10.4) prior to my 1st IVF cycle. I had a horrible response and had zero fertilization with ICSI. They told me it was poor egg quality. I had another FSH done which was 18.something. They also mentioned donor eggs for me, but I wanted to try IVF a few more times with my own eggs. I was successful the second time with a microdose lupron protocol. One hundred percent fertilization with ICSI (I only had 4 mature eggs).

A one-time high FSH value usually does mean you have decreased ovarian reserve and can mean you have poor quality eggs. However, I believe the protocol has a lot to do with the quality of the eggs retrieved. The microdose lupron flare protocol worked for me, but sometimes EPP is best for poor responders. I would at least give both protocols a shot before moving on to donor eggs.

How do they know the quality of your eggs is poor if your cycle was cancelled? You are still young. A lot of physicians say that when you are young with high FSH this means decreased quantity, with some decrease in quality, but not as drastic as someone who is older.

I would make sure prior to trying IVF I consulted with a couple of REs (they can do this over the phone). I consulted with CCRM, Cornell, and SIRM (the ones I heard were the best for poor responders). I decided not to use SIRM and was in between CCRM and Cornell. I ultimately decided on CCRM because of their success rates. They were very cautious with me about telling me of the poor chances with my high FSH (10%), but both CCRM and Cornell were willing to cycle me. I really had a much better response with my cycle with them and I cannot stress enough how much of a difference a new RE can make.

I also took wheatgrass and tried accupuncture. I don't know if it helped, but it may have.

[alfowler]

I agree. Don't give up and say ok to ED unless you are sure you are ready. I would have loved to have had 5 follies with my cycle. My Re is not super "high fsh friendly" but they are still working with me but they are know I read a lot and I ask them about different things to try all the time. BE PROACTIVE!!!!

I am doing an estrogen priming in conjuction with microflare lupron cycle this time so I am hoping and praying I respond better.

If I were you I would definately try some different options before going to ED. Good Luck!!

[schumachm]

I am the queen of poor response. See my signature! I never have more than a few follies, but what I make is great. I have fsh of 15 or more steadily. They have no idea what your quality will be until they harvest them. I can tell you this that I did the micro dose lupron proto once with success and once without success. I don't recomend it from all that I have researched. Might I suggest the antagonist proto. You don't use birth control, or anything to hold you back. It is short and sweet, and it usually nets better egg quality. Any lupron at all can effect egg quality. When I did antagonist cycle I made three embies, put them in on day 2, and ended up with three sacs. Now I have thriving twins growing inside me.

I would also suggest taking Royal Jelly/Bee Pollen in honey a few months before your next cycle. This stuff really improoves egg quality with no side effects. I use the YS brand bought from Vitamin Shoppe online. I can't say enough about this stuff.

I too recomend 2nd and 3rd opinions before you make choices. I consulted with CCRM, and two different local REs. This is very possible, and is well worth it. If you have any personal questions feel free to pm me. I wish you lots of luck.

[MissKris]

Lvtchr, check out the Royal Jelly thread, here:
Has anyone taken Royal Jelly?

Ditto to what the posters above said. Just because you respond poorly does not mean your eggs are poor quality. I credit RJ and accupuncture with my successful pregnancy.

[lvtchr]

Thanks a bunch for the info, glad you had success w/the lupron flare protocol. How would I go about getting a consult from another clinic like CCRM? Just call them? Do they charge for this?

[Ghost]

Originally Posted by lvtchr

Hi! I'm new to IVF and to this board and would like some advice. A bit of history...I'm 32, DH is 31; TTC for 3 yrs. Did 2 IUI w/injectables and both BFN. Up to now we've been "unexplained". We started an IVF cycle in early June (BCPs then Follistim/Luveris) but I only made 5 follies. Doc says that my FSH was elevated this month (17.8 vs. earlier results between 3-5) so that combined with my poor response makes me a "poor responder" and means I have lower quality eggs.

Does this make sense? Does a one-time high FSH value and lack of response mean my eggs really suck? For our next cycle she wants to try the microflare protocol w/lupron but she's already talking about a potential need to use donor eggs in the future if this cycle doesn't work out. This seems extreme to me since we haven't even officially tried IVF. Advice???

No, it does not make sense.

Elevated FSH merely indicates you have few antral follicles. It does not indicate the quality of the eggs that would arise from those follicles.

You do meet the definition of decreased ovarian reserve, and therefore probably would be a low responder in an IVF cycle, but your egg quality cannot be assessed from the available information you've posted.

If your clinic is turning you away or else is requiring or pressuring you into an egg donor cycle because of your fSH, then yes, a 2nd opinion is a good idea. Whether you proceed with your own eggs should be your own choice.

[kandygurl1971]

Hi there,

I ditto everything the other ladies have said. My FSH had been 15.7-15.8 prior to my successful IVF cycle. I haven't read anywhere that high FSH meant low antral follie count but would make sense to me since I only have one ovary and my AFC hovered around 5-7 but I was still able to get pregnant with only 4 eggs retrieve and 3 fertilized.

Get multiple Re opinions and and arm yourself with infomation from this forum and other places because I can honestly say that's what helped me. I was told to go the ED route more than once and believe it or not even by an RE at the practice I got my BFP so that's a sign that you can't let anyone discourage you.

[mises]

Good luck with your C-Section kandygurl1971 It's coming up soon. We were part of the October thread about 9 months ago. It is good to see that people can have positive outcomes.

[houston]

Originally Posted by lvtchr

Thanks a bunch for the info, glad you had success w/the lupron flare protocol. How would I go about getting a consult from another clinic like CCRM? Just call them? Do they charge for this?

I just called and asked for a phone consult. I think whether or not they charge for the consult depends on the state you are in. I am in Texas and the phone consult was free. The charge I believe is $250 if you are not in a state where it is free. I would call now, set up an appointment, request your medical records asap from your current provider (it can sometimes take a while), and send them to CCRM. They will review them with you for the phone consult.

[Ghost]

A good way to find clinics and their success rates is the SART website:

SART - Society for Assisted Reproductive Technology

If you click on a state, it brings up the list of clinics in that state. If you then click on a clinic, it brings up some info about the clinic, including their phone # and website.

You can also click on their success rates, but a few clinics don't report their success rates to SART.

CCRM indeed has high success rates, some of the best in Colorado. However, if you're going to Colorado, you might take a look at the clinic in Littleton called "Conceptions Reproductive Associates". Their success rates are at least as good, and with fewer embryos transferred. Fewer transferred embryos means less risk of triplets and such, which are high risk pregnancies.

[lvtchr]

Thanks everyone for all the great advice. I've started taking royal jelly/bee pollen and have been going to an acupuncturist for a long time, so I'll have to see what she says about this low responder/egg quality business since this is so new for me. I've also got some questions into my RE's office about other factors like my antral follicle count and my e2 level since they've never shared any of this with me.